Building Better Developers, Episode 626

Welcome to Building Better Developers, the developer podcast where we work on getting better step by step professionally and personally. Let's get started. Well, hello and welcome back. We are continuing our season of interviews. We are starting a new interview though. This time we're speaking with Adam Adams. Yes, actually his name, not a showbiz name or something like that. And he has a podcast on podcasts and has created podcasts in the past and sold them, which is part of the story that we will get as we talk. But this is going to be a little different because it is going to get a little deeper and a little more focused on the podcast side. We've talked about doing it as an exercise to understand the technology, to understand the skill set, to understand generating content. And we will get to that a little bit. But also he's going to talk a little bit more about why a business should have a podcast and how you should approach it so that you build or enhance your brand or reach customers maybe that you haven't otherwise. So whether you're doing a side hustle, you've got an organization or you're trying to talk your company into a podcast, this is an episode that's going to help you. Not to mention there's some really interesting general focus, we'll say kind of stories that come out of this. So it'll be worthwhile to kick back, listen to this discussion with Adam and here we go. So today we are talking with Adam Adams of a couple of things. Currently he has a podcast on podcasting. He has a site, a company, organization called GrowYourShow.com, which conveniently enough is about growing your podcast show. And he's got a great story, a lot of background and very much the kind of person that is going to help you sort of focus if you've thought about podcasting, what is it that is involved in it? He's going to share a couple of things that you probably don't know you can do with podcasts and then we'll go from there. But I expect this is going to be one of those that's like grab your pencil, grab your notepad because there's going to be a lot of good little nuggets are going to come out of this. And so since I am not the best poet or anything like that, I'm going to let you introduce yourself. So if you can give us sort of a little bit of your background and tell us a little bit about Adam. Love it. Love it. I have a couple of things that could resonate with your listener and some things that the listener might just be like, wow, that's a lot different from me. I was never in I.T. I always thought that I couldn't do anything with technology. Honestly, I was held back to start my original first podcast because I was overwhelmed by microphones and how to record and where it would go and how to edit what it would look like to edit. I launched the podcast and it really grew a business. And I'm hoping that's one of the things that we touch on today is just like the benefits of growing your brand. If you're going to sell a product, if you're going to advance your career, how maybe social media, how podcasting could support that growth in a few different ways. So my name is Adam Adams, literally my real name. Hardly anyone believes me. In fact, I lost my ID at the bar this week because I was buying everybody shots and somebody is like, your name is not Adam Adams. And I was an idiot and I gave them my identification and they still have it. So that is how do we do this? There we go. So Adam Adams and originally from Utah, but now I'm in Colorado, been podcasting for, I suppose it's been like eight years now coming up on seven and a half years. And it grew a company. And so I use it to support a business. And the business is my company. It's one that I launched. It helped me with my real estate investment company. And it's currently helping me with my podcast agency. Got a couple of kids, love mountain biking and I love going to Moab to play with my Jeep. That's a little bit about me. So and what part of Colorado are you in? I'm in, it's called Conifer up in the mountains, up to 85, not up 70, but close by Evergreen, Morrison, where Red Rocks Amphitheater is and not too far outside of Denver. Perfect area. If you like micro mountain biking, that is one of like, that is one of those God's countries kind of areas. I love that. That's, I was not a huge mountain bike biking fan until I was on 71 time. I took an off road and rented some for a day and I was like, I could do this the rest of my life. It's just like, it's a very, it's great, great exercise and great way to get back in touch with nature. And it's just very chill thing to do for sure. So I want to start into really, it's because you started right off saying that you were sort of held back with your first podcast sort of concerned by, it's just too technical. It's just stuff I can't understand. So I guess sort of a two part question is one, what motivated, what was the motivation to start that podcast? And then maybe a little bit about what allowed you to overcome that concern and say, okay, I can figure this out. Okay. The biggest motivation was I was started my, I started these couple of new companies and Gary Vaynerchuk, who's a great influencer. It does a really remarkable job at supporting people like me and you, and maybe your listener to be able to kind of be inspired and take the next step on what it is to grow our entrepreneurship business. And Gary V back in, I think it was 2015 that I was listening to him for the, not for the first time, because I'm huge into wine and I used to know him like back then, but for the first time as he's being more of an influencer in the entrepreneurship space. And he's talking about if you don't have a podcast and you're not active in social media by the year 2022, which we're almost done with 2022 as we record this, if you don't have it by that time, you will lose in business. So if you're an entrepreneur, if you're launching a podcast, these two things are critically important. For example, the podcast is your top of funnel. It's your way of getting in front of the most amount of people. It's your awareness portion of your business. Like now everybody knows you, they can talk about you, they can consume your content when you're asleep, they can share it with their friend, even when you're not really asking them to personally. And it really just grows your brand and allows you to add value to your people over and over and over and get, have them get to know who you are so that they can eventually work with you. I started listening to him talk about this and I said, man, I'm overwhelmed. I don't know the first thing about technology or how to start a podcast. I don't know how to record. I don't know anything about anything. But he's telling me if I don't do that and if I'm not active on social, and I was honestly like, why would I need to be active on social? I might actually come across today as a people person. I might actually come across today as very, what's the word for it, extroverted. And I think honestly, I kind of grew that because I've always been shy and to myself. I kind of grew that by having a podcast. So it wasn't me. It wasn't my natural, like where I wanted to go. But he told me, he told everybody, but I took it as he was talking to me directly. He wasn't, but I felt that way. I took it as, man, I've got to do these two things. It's going to be real uncomfortable putting myself out there on social. It's going to be real uncomfortable having a podcast because I really honestly, Rob, I'm not very eloquent. I mean, your listener knows that right now. They're like, this guy, he's not, he doesn't, he stumbles on his words. He doesn't always have the right exact same right thing to say. He fumbles and flubbers through. Why would he start a podcast? And that was me. If I do this, people are going to realize how dumb I am. People are going to, you know, all these insecurities that held me back and I hated it and I was scared of it. But what told me I needed to do it was Gary V, Gary Vaynerchuk. And so I started to figure out how do I do it? And I, there is one cool thing that about me that I, that I love and appreciate. And it is that I don't mind failing. I don't mind trying something and like not doing it so well and then approaching it in a different way. Kind of like whoever that person is who invented the light bulb, it might've been Edison. And he once said, you know, I haven't failed a thousand times or maybe he even said 10,000. I don't remember the quote, but I haven't failed a thousand times. I just figured out a thousand or 10,000 ways that don't work. And I don't mind that. I don't mind troubleshooting. I don't mind maybe looking like a fool for a second and then trying something new. And as I do that, I learn little breadcrumbs that lead me to the right place over time. And so to answer your other question, like how did you overcome it? I believed Gary that I had to do it. And so I started doing it and I made mistakes and I sounded like a dummy and I kept trying One of the things that I'll accomplish the most, which I think is going to be super impactful for the listener right now. One of the things that accomplished the most of all of these things is me just getting over myself, me getting not worrying about me and how I sound and how I come across, but worrying about the listener. Rob, you and I, what was my very first question when we started? It was who is your listener? What are they going through? What are they looking for? And when I like understand him or her, that person who's going through what they're going through, I feel like I have learned over time how to get out of how do I sound and come into what kind of value does that person need? And so you kind of like almost, almost like God or the universe or being directed by magical forces, almost like that. When you switch your focus on the service, when you switch your focus from being in your head, worrying about how you come across and just like adding true value to the person that's on the receiving end is speaking on stage or a podcast. I've slowly learned that it doesn't matter if I fumble. I've fumbled so many times on this episode and I could, I don't care. I don't care if somebody's going to judge me for that because I feel like they can feel my heart. I'm confident that they know that I'm coming from a place of value and service. You know what I mean? And that's really grown me as a speaker to be able to get on stage without being, I mean, my face might still go red on a stage, especially when there's a lot of people or especially if I know a couple of other people in there. But when I focus on the right part, which is not me, it's them. Something magical happens. It's amazing how many times I have talked with people and Gary Vee is a, is sort of like a, I feel like a mentor, like I like, I've never met him or anything like, but there's a lot about him that I look back on in particular, because I did start watching way back and I remember one of the earliest descriptions when somebody was talking about his show, as they said, it looked like it was about a step above a, you know, a kidnap or a terrorist video or something, because it's just, it looked just sort of grainy, sort of dark and stuff like that. But then seeing him as he went through his shows and seeing how, you know, it's like you make some adjustments, you make some changes. That to me is something where that's why I recommend to just about everybody that that even has a, has ever thought, what if I were to try a podcast and do it? You know, even if it's 10 episodes or even if you never actually go through the whole process, although I always recommend go through the whole, get it so that you can like get on your phone and you can say to your friend, Hey, I have a podcast and they can listen to an episode because I think there's so much you learn about just producing content about yourself. And particularly if you edit the times that I've, when I go in and edit my own stuff, I have learned so much about my, my mannerisms, how I speak, how I flub. It's mathematical. I can look at the audio file and see like, Oh, here's where I did that. Oh, yeah. It's just, it really is a, it's a fascinating thing to me on a way to just improve yourself and your ability to get, it's just like, you know, hearing yourself on a recording is always useful, but a podcast, I think even more so because now you've got this content, you're trying to tell a story or share something or have a conversation. And then it's, how do you do that? And then of course, you're always going to be your worst critic. So, you know, for me, it's always, okay, I didn't do this right. I did that right. I knew that, right. So how can I do this better the next time around? Yeah. So I agree. It's, it really is. It's a, it's a great way to not only improve your, your organization. And I've forgotten about that, but that is a hundred percent true. And it seemed weird seven or eight years ago to say, you got to be on social media, you gotta have a podcast or you gotta have, you know, then it was, I guess you two was sort of getting going, but it's like, you've got to have that, that ability for your customers to essentially talk to you whenever they feel like it. And the benefits are just as you've seen it. And if you've noted it's, they are the point where you say you have to have it. Yeah. And it's, it may not be something you can always put a hard number to, but it's one of those that I think you've, you know, it's too many people that have done it that have said, yeah, I don't know if I can tell you exactly how much, but I know that it has been a great benefit to do that. Yeah. Hey, I have a question for you, Rob, just hopefully it's fast. Is there, cause you've done like 600 episodes, which I commend you. That's remarkable. You've done like 600 episodes and I'm curious, like over the 600, you've learned, you've grown, you've, you, you might've said something and then you hold onto it and you keep saying it. Is that, is that the case for you? Is there, is there analogies that you frequently use that you've slowly learned over time? And now you know that it's one of the most effective ways to express the topic. Yeah. Now we, we bounce around a lot of topics, but there are definitely themes that recur on a regular basis because there's, it doesn't matter what your business is or where you're starting. There are things that you have to do that just everybody does as part of that drive to, you know, that starts as that little seed. And then that says, Hey, I sort of want to do this. I think I could turn this into a business and then going through the steps that gets you to that point. So there, there is definitely, there are a lot of those recurring themes. And even within, we do, I've done series seasons over the years where it's sort of like, you know, focused for 20, 30 episodes. And it's amazing how many times I'll go into a season on something either very technical or entrepreneurial and then get towards the end and go, wow, there's like things that I never really thought of that now have surfaced as I've gone through these topics. So it's always for me, it's as sometimes as educational, almost maybe more so to do the podcast as it would be to listen to one. Cause I'm also an avid podcast listener and I've listened to many over the years and things like interviews to me or have become my favorite because there's always so much I get out of that. I would just, I've noticed that after, and I haven't done as many episodes as you on, on the podcast on podcasting. I've done 250 to 300 now as we're recording. And, and I'm starting to notice that over time, there's, there's some things that I continue to repeat. For example, I'll talk about how important it is if you have a show to draw a line in the sand. And then I tell this story about a cave person who discovered fire and drew a line in the sand and got half of the tribe to follow him. And it's like every time I talk about standing for something or having a unique niche for your show, I talk about drawing a line in the sand. And I talk about this cave person and his, his story of figuring out fire. And another example that I frequently use is ready aim fire versus the ready fire aim, the mentality that everybody's like, just start, don't overthink it done is better than perfect. And I talk about how helpful it can be to like, like launch a podcast. If you go ready, aim fire, spend the time to aim before you fire. And like the biggest and best people out there, Dave Ramsey, for example, I mean, he's put out even more content than you, you've got 600 episodes. It's insane. And he might, he might be in the 10,000. He might honestly be in the 10,000 is range of recorded content. And he, he keeps saying the same dang thing on almost every time I hear him, he talks about how the paid off mortgage is replacing the BMW as a status symbol. And it's, it's interesting because he's drawing his line of sand. He's, he's saying those things, but he's using like the same examples, the same analogies, the same differentiators to prove a point even at thousands of episodes in. So I just thought that was interesting. And I, I thought I'd ask. Yeah, it's to me, it's, I think about it as the, if you're building a construction, a physical building, there's the idea of the cornerstone that goes way back to the first building ever built, which basically says, okay, this is the corner. This is a, you know, a 90 degree angle and we're going to go wall. One wall goes this way. One goal wall goes that way. And as you're laying out the bricks, the goal is you come back to that cornerstone to keep the bricks in line. Otherwise you get a little off. The next thing you know, you're, you're way off track. And it, to me, there's always in a lot of topics and a lot of areas, there are core things that it helps all of us, no matter how often we've done it, whether you've done 10,000 episodes or, or a hundred or 10 is to have that and just sort of be able to look back to it. Like you said, that that drawing, drawing that line in the sand that says, okay, am, is that where I want to be? Is, am I following the path that I set out that I wanted to follow? And yeah, you've got to, you've got to think about what that path is before you go. Otherwise you may go in the completely wrong direction. And that, I think that this leads well, perfect dovetail into when you did your first podcast, you've, you've, one of the things you mentioned, you know, you made some mistakes, especially because you've, you've moved on to another. And I know you've learned from those and help others learn from those. So what are maybe a couple of the key mistakes that, and particularly the kind where it's like, this is stuff that most people that, you know, as you've gone through and talked to people, this is something people make a lot and where I highly recommend that you aim and don't, you know, repeat this mistake. 100%, one of them we mentioned briefly, and it is the, the ready fire aim. I was told, and I believed it, it wasn't my fault. Everybody else was telling me, don't overthink it, just have a podcast, put out the content. It doesn't have to do this or that. And so I, honestly, I went ready fire aim. I went ready fire aim. I went done is better than perfect. I went against the seven habits of highly effective people. Stephen Covey says, and you mentioned this a second ago, Robert, Rob, begin with the end in mind. I didn't do that. I didn't like think through clearly of who is my avatar? How do I serve them? What is my avatar going through? What are they worried about? What are they trying to achieve? How many kids do they have? What part of the country do they live in? What keeps them up at night? I didn't think about all of those things. And I just created content that was good, good content, but not, not focused content on the avatar. So I start my purpose. I had a purpose for the podcast. Okay. I decided that I wanted to serve people and help them with real estate investing. And my goal was to raise private equity, my overarching. I hope that people that listen might not want to do all the work on their own. Instead, they might want to call me and put their money with me so I can buy bigger deals. That was like my thought, but it wasn't a consistent congruent message that made sense. So I was interviewing all sorts of random people. They weren't all for my avatar. They weren't all for that person that I wanted listening. They weren't all to help me to be able to become, to raise equity. So I was adding value to all of the people instead of my avatar. So basically I should have not called my podcast, creative real estate, because I want millionaires to listen. And I want millionaires who understand how to leverage other people's time and other people's experience. But instead I was adding value to the poorest of people that wanted to leverage other people's monies to still be able to do deals, but without any of their credit or any of their money. So my content was serving a completely wrong person. This is the whole reason why I ended up selling it after I finally realized it three years into my journey, three years. And actually there was almost 600 episodes of that podcast before I sold it, but three years and almost 600 episodes later, I realized I'm not even serving the person that I want. I need to have a title of my whole podcast that attracts somebody who's a multimillionaire. I need to attract somebody who wants to be passive, not active. So I need to stop interviewing people and asking you, asking my guests, how did you find this deal? A passive investor, a private lender, an equity investor, and a limited partner doesn't care at all about how to talk to a broker because they'll never do it. They just want to be able to put their money passively and leverage my experience, leverage my time. But I wasn't serving that person. I was serving a totally different person. It grew my brand. It allowed me to speak on multiple stages. It allowed me to make a lot of money eventually. But if I would have been more conscious and specific and focused from the beginning, I would have never sold it because it would have achieved everything that I wanted. So the biggest mistake ever was Ready, Fire, Aim. My biggest mistake was not being intentional every step of the way, intentional with the name of my podcast, the colors that I use that attract my avatar, the fonts, the people that I have as guests. If I do a solo episode, what I should say on the solo episode, the content that I'm producing, I was missing the mark because I was kind of like flailing about believing other people that said, just start, don't overthink it. And that seems like a perfect place for us to pause for this episode. We will come back next episode. We're going to continue our discussion with Adam. Hopefully you've already picked up on a couple of things. He's very much into the idea of intentionally going into a business. And while we do talk often about the idea of just do it, but there is also often that intent as well. There are the things that we want to, you just need to do. You've got to take that first step. But then if you want to truly succeed, it does go back to that idea, that cornerstone ideas, have a goal, have a desire, have a why, and make sure that you are intentional getting towards that why. And that will make a difference that will help you. And his story was great. I love how he talked about that, that drift that he had in his podcast, because I think a lot of us do the same. It is not uncommon for us to get into a product and a project and we're solving this problem. And the next thing you know, we're solving 15 other problems. And rather than get what we need done, we drift into these other topics. And so while it may be a different concept, a different context, still, I think a lot of us can relate to exactly what he did where we get into something and those shiny objects start showing up and we get distracted instead of staying intentional and focused. That being said, I'm going to let you go out and stop being distracted by this, get out there and get intentional and focused about your day and your week and we will catch you next time around. So go out there and have yourself a great day, a great week. As I said, we will talk to you next time. Thank you for listening to Building Better Developers, the Develop-a-Nor Podcast. You can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, Amazon, anywhere that you can find podcasts. We are there. And remember, just a little bit of effort every day ends up adding into great momentum and great success. One more thing before you go, Develop-a-Nor Podcast and site are a labor of love. We enjoy whatever we do trying to help developers become better. But if you've gotten some value out of this and you'd like to help us be great, if you go out to developernor.com slash donate and donate whatever feels good for you. If you get a lot of value, a lot. If you don't get a lot of value, even a little would be awesome. In any case, we will thank you and maybe I'll make you feel just a little bit warmer as well. Now you can go back and have yourself a great day.