Detailed Notes
Hello, and welcome to Season 22 of our podcast! As we dive into this new season, we’re excited to embark on a journey that explores the path of becoming and evolving as developers. This season is dedicated to the developer journey, focusing on the steps and lessons contributing to building a better developer. Whether you're just starting or looking to enhance your existing skills, this season has something for everyone.
The Developer Journey
This season is all about the various routes one can take to become a developer and the steps to improve continually. We'll cover foundational skills, necessary certifications, and how to build a solid resume. Becoming a developer can start with a computer science degree, a coding boot camp, or a career switch from a different field. Regardless of where you start, every developer faces typical milestones and challenges.
Continue Reading... https://develpreneur.com/the-developer-journey-welcome-to-season-22
Stay Connected: Join the Developreneur Community
We invite you to join our community and share your coding journey with us. Whether you’re a seasoned developer or just starting, there’s always room to learn and grow together. Contact us at [email protected] with your questions, feedback, or suggestions for future episodes. Together, let’s continue exploring the exciting world of software development.
Additional Resources
* Becoming Better Developers: A Retrospective on Season 21 of Our Developer Journey (https://develpreneur.com/becoming-better-developers-a-retrospective-on-season-21-of-our-developer-journey/)
* Develpreneur School and Training Material (https://school.develpreneur.com/)
* Behind The Scenes Podcasts Episodes (https://develpreneur.com/category/podcast/behind-the-scenes/)
Transcript Text
[Music] and we are are back I actually hit record almost right away this time and the first thing we're going to do is figure out what the heck is Season 22 gonna be because we have not figured this out yet so you get really behind the scenes at this point uh let's see do we have notes do we think about you threw something out there yeah on slack Season 22 ideas getting started first job early years on the job when it's time to move up oh life cycle full career cycle of a developer which actually um sits really well with if I can find the book itself I have it here uh yes let me go look at the table of contents here the outline or whatever it was how well did I write this let's see let's see why we need better developers perm Foundation steud Learning solving problems understand the business creating a niche using tools learn earn as you learn mentors and teammates that's not quite that level but it's not a bad idea for a season would be sort of like working our way through what are some like comment how are we going to do that so it's not just I think just describing it's probably not going to be what we want we probably want to get a little more complicated into that or a little more right useful sharing stuff like that I guess we could do like I mean I did do you know the Lessons Learned which was basically like War Stories uh a little bit uh mistakes I've made that we could sort of do it that way is we could start uh we could do a season and so the first you know fourth of it maybe is our look at like the first quarter of our career to date or maybe we can do like 10 episodes that are roughly the first first third of our career then the second third of our career and then the third third of our career and then have a couple that are basic like this is where we see it going kind of thing and some places you can go and what you can do and how to plan with retirement maybe that you know those kinds of things I think that would be like we'd go all over the place with that if we wanted to it's keep it sort of in the life cycle of the sdlc except for the developer life cycle the DLC I guess very different from downloaded yeah because I thought you know we've kind of touched on different areas of the career we've talked about different areas of software um last season was kind of a good well-rounded behind the scenes being a better developer but I I kept asking myself well what if you aren't a developer or what if you're just starting in a coding or you know what if you're just out of college you know where would you begin and you know how do this journey kind of look like and this kind of came around from some conversations that the kids and I have been having because you know she works for the state and right now they're under a hiring freeze but she is starting to consider okay where do I want to go you know do I want to stay at this job do I want to you know basically what do I want to be when I grow up kind of thing and it made me think back that you know we've been talking about being a better developer kind of jumping in at those that have development knowledge or have already been at this for a while but we never really talked about you know like how we started or getting started kind of uh we may have way back you know years ago but I thought this would be kind of be like a journey like let's walk them through the Journey of a developer like starting out you know where to begin maybe interview ideas finding jobs you know looking for you know what type of topics are interesting to you you know are you a devops guy are you a software guy are you know web versus backend um we never you know we touch on these things in particular topics but we never kind of comprehend it in in that concept uh if that makes sense yeah I'm trying to think about because we don't I don't know if we want to go all the way back and work on and focus on that um that specific Market or target audience right now but I am thinking that we could do the same thing and talk about pros and cons of how we approached it and then how to adjust accordingly because there are going to be people that are there are probably people right now listening to us that are uh developers that did not come up out of the normal set I know there's a lot that you know either had that's a second career they went and got a like an art degree or an education degree or something like that and then got into development or they've gone through boot camps or you know things like that there's so many different ways you can get into it and where you know where there's some strengths where you may want to like again it's actually I think it is a better developer thing because we can talk about like where do you Shore up the gaps in your skills and it doesn't hurt I think we can mix in there things like what is you preparing for a um an interview and things like that that are like pretty useful at any point you know any stage it's just sort of like our own lessons learn particularly from us like interviewing because we've we've been on both sides of that several times where we've interviewed we've been interviewees we've done you know Tech skill U Tex screenings and things like that so there's I think there's a lot we can work with that just keep it we'll talk about what maybe call like the developer journey and just sort of that gives us a nice like you know title and then we can just go from there yeah I kind of like that the the journey is kind of where I kind of had it in mind it's like you know yeah we don't necessarily need to go all the way back to the beginning but kind of a more beginning middle end kind of structure instead of jumping around kind of like we did there's nothing wrong with that but I think this will make this season a little more focused from beginning to end yeah I think we sort of started Star Wars four five and six so now we'll go back and cover one two three but do it better than they did and then we'll go more forward and get the get the rest of it cool I think we can do that we'll we'll do an overview this time and then we'll sort of work our way from there all right so are we so is this the introduction to the season or is episode one okay yeah and I'm gonna wing it as I never do so we'll just sort figure out how the conversation goes and uh try to do this and figure it all out this time around so hello and welcome to Season 22 you don't see me holding my little piece thingies up but hey that's where we're at we've started a new season we didn't even pause from season 21 to 22 I don't remember if we I think we did from 20 to 21 because we took a year and a half we're try to keep this down to you know get a couple Seasons a year out this season this episode we're going to talk about the season this season is going to be uh the developer Journey we want to get a lot of the pieces in that are the things that are building at a better developer but it's also getting you to become a developer in the first place in a sense we're talk a little bit about some of the foundational things and particularly some of the cases where we become developers from so many different areas it's the different ways that we do it and then how do we then fill out essentially and flesh out our resume how do we fill out our skill set because you could be some came out of school and you you need to get some certifications or maybe you came out of a boot camp and you want to get some foundational stuff or maybe you came from a different career and you want to be able to figure out like where can I go you maybe I you know I was in a different career I learned say JavaScript can do a couple web things but I want to see what else is out there so this is going to be in a way very allinclusive but really what we want to do is sort of talk about the developer Journey how do you it's not just building better developers but it's like what are some of the stops along the way some of the the lessons that we've learned and before I drone on too long I will introduce myself uh especially since a new season I am Ron Broadhead I am one of the founders of develop andur I'm also founder of RB Consulting so the two things I do we consult we do Integrations we do simplification we do Automation and then I use developer to give back to the community on the other side of the world possibly but definitely on the other side of the internet but in a little box on my screen is Michael and I'll let you go ahead and introduce yourself hey everyone my name is Michael Mage I'm one of the co-founders of developer ner and I'm also the founder of Envision QA where we help small to midsize businesses and clinicians build software to meet their custom needs as well as test software and support and maintenance it is really tempting to after mentioning that small screen is do like a little squishing your head thing but it's I guess I could do it uh here I could squish my head but it's a little different anyways H Kids in the Hall I think is what it was talking about the developer Journey we we've got we've come into this just sort of like where do we want to go with our season if you look back over 20 plus Seasons there are a lot of areas where we've touched on how do you become a developer how do you become a better developer how do you do all the things that turn you into the help you to become a better on entrepreneur you know that develop preneur side of it as well we've talked about branding we've talked about marketing we've talked about skills we've talked about projects and interviews and all these different things but it makes sense to have a little hopefully we plan on having a little cohesiveness to this this time around and more like a not really a full punch list but maybe a little bit of an outline of like here's some things some topics that you want to think about as you're growing that you may already have but it's also things that you want to you you want to step back to for example we've talked I think we've talked recently in these as I know I've had these conversations it is the idea of uh we've talked about it more on a on a company level rebranding but even within yourself particularly if you've you know if you've been doing this for a few years it's actually rebranding in the way of s of like your resume or personal website or your company's website because there's going to be things that you did 10 years ago that really don't make sense right now so if you were a you could be a very not even Cutting Edge but like let's say just a Leading Edge developer 10 gears years ago you might have been a Leading Edge developer using flash that you had all these websites and you were using Adobe Air and all that kind of stuff doesn't basic basically doesn't exist anymore no offense to those you that do it on a daily basis I know there's a few out there but not a lot of it out there so now you maybe have moved on to Let's sayet or Java or something like that you need then to upgrade your your your resume your site and one of the things we'll talk about is like how do you how do you handle that stuff because you are growing you're becoming a better developer so when do you sort of like you know cut back the stuff that you used to have when do you drop dos you know 3.0 or you know windows or whatever off of your resume when do you put like you know basic not Visual Basic but Capital basic basic off fre list those kinds of things are what we're going to sort of get into and a lot of it is really definitely not a science this is going to be lessons learned it's where we have seen some uh some things that have confused us or that we've done that have confused others because we have worked both sides we have we have interviewed people we have been reviewed by a lot of people we have been through text screens we have gone through we've text screened people I want to just I think we'll get a lot of that out there like some of our experience and where we've seen things that we feel are done right and where we see some things that are done wrong and now I say we all the time and I'm not speaking just in the Royal wi so I want to have like want you thr a couple of things like where you see this going as well Michael because we've got 30 plus episodes ahead of us so obviously we're going to cover a lot of ground yeah yeah as we go through this journey we're going to be talking or touching on a lot of the both pain points of our Journeys some of the things that we struggled with as well as a lot of the things that we learned that oh this is a great idea or how we excelled in some areas how we struggled in certain areas and how we basically uh persevered through some hard times because in any developer's Journey you're going to run into situations where it's like why the hell did I do this why am I doing this and you kind of lose that kind of you you lose that emphasis you lose that Spirit of hey this is awesome I'm having fun let's do this especially like for those of you that are entrepreneurs and doing startups you always start out with like I have this great idea I'm going to do it and you know you hit the accelerator you go go go go and then you hit a wall and then you're like well now what I I don't want to do this anymore or it burned out and these are a lot of things that we have encountered through our development journey and we're going to try to talk through some of these topics and you know help you guys on your journey of becoming better developers I mean you could be a junior you could be a mid-level hell you could be like us you could be 20 plus years in this industry and still we're always learning this journey never ends until you either retire or basically you decide to throw your computer out the window and become a monk and I think that's it's important that this is not uh this is a journey that never end we're we're constantly having to update and keep going and honestly I don't know how many times I've thrown my computer out the window become a monk and the next thing you know I'm I'm writing code in the monastery and then I'm back again and so you know I think that's something else that we you that's definitely another area we want to talk about is the uh you I I I keep thinking Lion King Circle of Life but there's a little bit of like there's seasons of our development I think that we I know for me that I have been through where and it does seem cyclical where it's like you get into a much like you know software development life cycle I think in general it's you'll get into Seasons where you're doing a lot of coding or you're doing a lot of maybe you're doing some project management or some some team management maybe you're in a lot of agile then maybe you're in a lot of like just straight web based applications maybe you're doing a lot of mobile there's a it's just those kinds of things things that I also want to talk about like what we do when we're in a certain season to make sure that that doesn't become a rut because a lot of this is about us looking at what what do we accept what do we have to accept basically as developers because there's certain things that are just part and parcel of being a developer your whatever you know today is going to disappear doesn't matter how long it is now there are foundational things and we I I do want to spend some time on that because I think that's something that has served me well is a very strong foundation in in software development to start with and by I'm talking about things like understanding what Collections and the you know various patterns are and and some of those like you know basic concepts of like how do you do logic like what is The Logical arithmetic and some of those kinds of things and even like vectors and data storage things and stuff that you may or may not know or you may have come into it in a uh a very specific way you know like a Lambda or something like that that you may have a very different view of what that looks like from actual you know like bison and all those and yak and all those other kinds of things that are about building languages so there's a lot out there uh there's a lot that I want to talk about and I think we're going to try to do it you know we'll try to do it like a sort of like a nugget at a time we'll try to you know take off a good chewable amount to say here's something we've done here's some of our experience and throw some recommendations out there as well now as always we do want to get feedback from you so if you've got some things you know something that's like maybe a a big lesson learn in your career that you would love for us to share you know or a question like hey I'm stuck I'm sort of like I've I've hit a ceiling or uh the one that everybody runs into is there sort of that fork in the road where there's some point where you can go much more you can go into like management or you go into into higher-end architecture stuff now some companies don't even have that sometimes it's just like you top out and you're just going to write code write code write code you just get to write more code or something like that or write it faster versus you know hope hopefully it's a large enough organization that you're in that allows you to manage or design and architect Solutions I see you in the back with your hand up so it's interesting with that as well we can also talk about not just those kind kind of transition but also talk about when you're in a position or a role and you're starting to get into a rut or Things become toxic when do identify when is it time to either shift gears and start looking for different positions or even start looking for different companies because there are times where while we're enjoying this journey we are going to run into situations where we are not going to be happy but we as developers a lot of times though we try to persevere because we like solving problems you know that's the whole thing about writing software but sometimes the problem isn't us the problem isn't something we can solve and then it's time to like look at the door is it time to go somewhere else so these are some of the things we can address this season as well I that's a greate now granted sometimes the problem's not me it's always Michael but for the rest of you um I think this is something you know that is something that we I think there boy every season of of development and progression that you're in that is something that gets handled a little differently and I think just to sort of to to wrap this one up is I will I will flashback a little looking back at some of the things that I did starting out and I've seen this with a lot of other people as they start out so it's sort of to give you like a A Slice of Life of some of the kinds of things we're going to talk about when I started out I had a I had a college degree I had a a bachelor's in computer science so I knew some stuff about programming and I just come out of school so I knew some academic stuff about programming now you may say I never you know went to school for it I went to like maybe a boot camp well you're going to have the same thing you're going to come out of that boot camp with the the boot camp shine you're going to have like this certain thing that you've now you've done some work you've built applications probably of some sort but you've done it in a uh a lot of times sort of like a pristine environment you are you are set up in your projects you are graded on like you've got to do it right the right way and the right way is whatever that book or that Professor or whatever you know and it's a lot of it is based on the the goals they want to accomplish what do they want you to understand coming out of that class and when I came out I had like this is the stuff that I know and I at that point objector there was no agile this was like way back you didn't really have that yet it was close to that time but but you did have objectoriented and objectoriented was the thing that was like objectoriented languages and inheritance and all this stuff everybody was just like in awe at what you could do with objectoriented because they were they come out of at this point everybody was functional Bas so you had all this stuff you had all this repetitive code you had all this just crud that you had to sort through so when I walked into the the real world and walked out of my academic environment that was in my head and I will once again apologize to anybody that worked with me at the time because every problem to me because the hammer that I had was objectoriented and that was the tool I had so I Ed that on everything it didn't matter if it was a a script it didn't matter if it was batch programming I tried to find a way to take that big square peg of object oriented and slam it into a round hole over and over again and I'm G to claim you know ask for forgiveness and all that and and also claim that it's not my fault because everybody does that because we do we it's it's affected my career ever since because think we do we get this thing that's a really shiny new tool and then we really want to use it now when we come out of school we have one tool so we don't really have a lot of choice or you know we have like a couple but it's we're really focused but as you get further into your career you'll find that you get that shiny tool again and you're like I really want to use this it's like if you go get a new coffee cup you want to have that you're like I want coffee right now because I want to use my new cup that that's something that we struggle with I think more than we would like to admit and that's one of those things that we're going to we will come back to this at some point in this season and talk about such things because we do have a struggle there is a balance of we don't want to lose it we don't want to have something that we learned and then not use it then we lose it but we also don't want to bore everybody with telling about how we've got this great new Silver Bullet solution and then it it doesn't work and there's there's a lot of those in the history of what I've worked through so I'm sure we will this is not going to be all about failures and mistakes we did a season on that but this is going to be about uh a little bit about lesson learn but really more about you know more like these are some things we've done it's our experiences so hopefully you'll be able to connect with where you have where you have done some of the stuff and some of it will be new there'll be some things like I've never done something that way so I'm going to go give that a shot closing thoughts from you yeah a lot of this is again this is the development Journey season so we are going to be talking about Journeys through the career of becoming a better developer and our hope is that by the end of this season you will have something to take away even if it's small but something like me that every day you look at what you're doing and you want to learn something new you want to better yourself you want to become better I think that is well put and a perfect way to wrap up this first episode of Season 22 it's just it I'm still getting my head around this that we're like that far into this thing hope you come back and enjoy us on our journey as we talk about the developer Journey as always shoot us an email at info veneur decom if you have any questions comments suggestions jokes even if they're dad jokes we'll take them all may or may not share them because if they're too puny then it may just be a little too much for us also have the YouTube channel we have developer.com we're out there on X we are out there on LinkedIn on Facebook wherever you get your developer nor material we're we're there uh podcast as well wherever you consume your podcast you probably hopefully right now you're listening to it but subscribe wherever it is get all the latest stuff we're cranking this out twice a week and they'll just make it easier for you to keep up with us uh you can always ask the lady in the Box uh also known as Alexa at some point just hey give me the latest episode of building better developers and you know what you'll get to hear our dlet tones come across the uh whatever the devices you're listening on that being said we're going to wrap this one up we're going to go take a break come back Season 22 episode 2 will be next so we will catch you next time around go out there and have yourself a great day a great week and we will talk to you next time and a wave to those of you that didn't but yeah it's also a good little signal to be like cut all right there goes the uh that's the audio for the rest of you you get to see the the video uh I don't know if there's there any bonus material you want to throw out there anything that's like sort of a extra bonus highlight secret uh like you know secret eggs that we're going to have somewhere you know out e we have somewhere in the season it's like keep an eye out for this one the only extra thing I would like to add since this is our introductory episode to the season is we didn't touch on it but we also have school ofd developer.com we have tons of material on the website we have launching an internet business for those of you that may not have a website or a business you know make sure you go out and check that it's free we W walk you through the entire setup of setting up AWS WordPress and basically putting up a website for free you know check this stuff out we've got tons of material out there and if you thought about it chances are we've either talked about it or we probably done it or if we haven't shoot us an email or a text or you know just communicate to us what you would like us to talk about and hey we may throw it on an episode or we might drop it in the blog yeah sometimes some of our best topics are you know I haven't done that I would L like to try it let's go give it a shot and you next thing you know we'll have some tutorials or maybe even a whole season on it depending on on what it is we will wrap this one up and we will come back around soon as you just like I mentioned every Tuesday and Thursday we drop these things we have them on you can get us out on the podcast or you can join us here on YouTube or if you're somewhere else like a Chinese YouTube or wherever you're seeing this you could go to the original at YouTube or whatever this pirate channel is that you're watching uh and actually if you are love to hear about it just be really interesting to know that we are somewhere else especially if we're being dubbed that would be awesome I would love to hear somebody dubbing Us in Swahili or whatever the language happens to be that being said we'll let you guys get to it we're going to go back to it and we will come back with episode two uh a couple days from now basically when you next swing around we will be cranking in to Season 22 have a good one [Music]
Transcript Segments
[Music]
and we are are back I actually hit
record almost right away this time and
the first thing we're going to do is
figure out what the heck is Season 22
gonna be because we have not figured
this out yet so you get really behind
the scenes at this point uh let's see do
we have notes do we think about you
threw something out
there yeah on slack Season 22 ideas
getting started first job early years on
the job when it's time to move up oh
life cycle full career cycle of a
developer which
actually um sits really well with if I
can find the book itself I have it here
uh yes let me go look at the table of
contents here the outline or whatever it
was how well did I write this let's
see let's see why we need better
developers perm Foundation steud
Learning solving problems understand the
business creating a niche using tools
learn earn as you learn mentors and
teammates that's not quite that
level but it's not a bad idea
for a season would be sort of like
working our way through what are some
like comment how are we going to do that
so it's not just I think just describing
it's probably not going to be what we
want we probably want to get a little
more complicated into that or a little
more right useful sharing stuff like
that I guess we could do like I mean I
did do you know the Lessons Learned
which was basically like War Stories uh
a little bit uh mistakes I've made that
we could sort of do it that way is we
could start uh we could do a season and
so the first you know fourth of it maybe
is
our look at like the first quarter of
our career to date or maybe we can do
like 10 episodes that are roughly the
first first third of our career
then the second third of our career and
then the third third of our career and
then have a couple that are basic like
this is where we see it going kind of
thing and some places you can go and
what you can do and how to plan with
retirement maybe that you know those
kinds of things I think that would be
like we'd go all over the place with
that if we wanted to it's keep it sort
of in the life cycle of the sdlc except
for the developer life cycle the DLC I
guess very different from
downloaded yeah because I thought you
know we've kind of touched on different
areas of the career we've talked about
different areas of
software um last season was kind of a
good well-rounded behind the scenes
being a better developer but I I kept
asking myself well what if you aren't a
developer or what if you're just
starting in a coding or you know what if
you're just out of college you know
where would you begin and you know how
do this journey kind of look
like and this kind of came around from
some conversations that the kids and I
have been having because you know she
works for the state and right now
they're under a hiring freeze but she is
starting to consider okay where do I
want to go you know do I want to stay at
this job do I want to you know basically
what do I want to be when I grow up kind
of thing
and it made me think back that you know
we've been talking about being a better
developer kind of jumping in at those
that have development knowledge or have
already been at this for a while but we
never really talked about you know like
how we started or getting started kind
of uh we may have way back you know
years ago but I thought this would be
kind of be like a journey like let's
walk them through the Journey of a
developer like starting out you know
where to begin maybe interview ideas
finding jobs you know looking for you
know what type of topics are interesting
to you you know are you a devops guy are
you a software guy are you know web
versus backend um we never you know we
touch on these things in particular
topics but we never kind of comprehend
it in in that concept uh if that makes
sense yeah I'm trying to think about
because we
don't I don't know if we want to go all
the way back and work on and focus on
that um that specific Market or target
audience right now but I am thinking
that we could do the same thing and talk
about pros and cons of how we approached
it and then how to adjust accordingly
because there are going to be people
that are there are probably people right
now listening to us that
are uh developers that did not come up
out of the normal set I know there's a
lot that you know either had that's a
second career they went and got a like
an art degree or an education degree or
something like that and then got into
development or they've gone through boot
camps or you know things like that
there's so many different ways you can
get into it and where you know where
there's some strengths where you may
want to like again it's actually I think
it is a better developer thing because
we can talk about like where do you
Shore up the gaps in your skills and it
doesn't hurt I think we can mix in there
things like what is you preparing for a
um an interview and things like that
that are
like pretty useful at any point you know
any stage it's just sort of like our own
lessons learn particularly from us like
interviewing because we've we've been on
both sides of that several times where
we've interviewed we've been
interviewees we've done you know Tech
skill U Tex screenings and things like
that so there's I think there's a lot we
can work with that just keep
it we'll talk about what maybe call like
the developer journey and just sort of
that gives us a nice like you know title
and then we can just go from there yeah
I kind of like that the the
journey is kind of where I kind of had
it in mind it's like you know yeah we
don't necessarily need to go all the way
back to the beginning but kind of a more
beginning middle end kind of structure
instead of jumping around kind of like
we did there's nothing wrong with that
but I think this will make this season a
little more focused from beginning to
end yeah I think we sort of started Star
Wars four five and six so now we'll go
back and cover one two three but do it
better than they did and then we'll go
more forward and get the get the rest of
it cool I think we can do that we'll
we'll do an overview this time and then
we'll sort of work our way from there
all right so are we so is this the
introduction to the season or is episode
one okay yeah and I'm gonna wing it as I
never do so we'll just sort figure out
how the conversation goes and uh try to
do this and figure it all out this time
around so hello and welcome to Season
22 you don't see me holding my little
piece thingies up but hey that's where
we're at we've started a new season we
didn't even pause from season 21 to 22 I
don't remember if we I think we did from
20 to 21 because we took a year and a
half we're try to keep this down to you
know get a couple Seasons a year
out this season this episode we're going
to talk about the season this season is
going to be uh the developer Journey we
want to get a lot of the pieces in that
are the things that are building at a
better developer but it's also getting
you to become a developer in the first
place in a sense we're talk a little bit
about some of the foundational things
and particularly some of the cases where
we become developers from so many
different areas it's the different ways
that we do it and then how do we then
fill out essentially and flesh out our
resume how do we fill out our skill set
because you could be some came out of
school and you you need to get some
certifications or maybe you came out of
a boot camp and you want to get some
foundational stuff or maybe you came
from a different career and you want to
be able to figure out like where can I
go you maybe I you know I was in a
different career I learned say
JavaScript can do a couple web things
but I want to see what else is out there
so this is going to be in a way very
allinclusive but really what we want to
do is sort of talk about the developer
Journey how do you it's not just
building better developers but it's like
what are some of the stops along the way
some of the the lessons that we've
learned and before I drone on too long I
will introduce myself uh especially
since a new season I am Ron Broadhead I
am one of the founders of develop andur
I'm also founder of RB Consulting so the
two things I do we consult we do
Integrations we do simplification we do
Automation and then I use developer to
give back to the community on the other
side of the world possibly but
definitely on the other side of the
internet but in a little box on my
screen is Michael and I'll let you go
ahead and introduce yourself hey
everyone my name is Michael Mage I'm one
of the co-founders of developer ner and
I'm also the founder of Envision QA
where we help small to midsize
businesses and clinicians build software
to meet their custom needs as well as
test software and support and
maintenance it is really tempting to
after mentioning that small screen is do
like a little squishing your head thing
but it's I guess I could do it uh here I
could squish my head but it's a little
different
anyways H Kids in the Hall I think is
what it
was talking about the developer Journey
we we've got we've come into this just
sort of like where do we want to go with
our season if you look back over 20 plus
Seasons there are a lot of areas where
we've touched on how do you become a
developer how do you become a better
developer how do you do all the things
that turn you into the help you to
become a better on entrepreneur you know
that develop preneur side of it as well
we've talked about branding we've talked
about marketing we've talked about
skills we've talked about projects and
interviews and all these different
things but it makes sense to have a
little hopefully we plan on having a
little cohesiveness to this this time
around and more like a not really a full
punch list but maybe a little bit of an
outline of like here's some things some
topics that you want to think about as
you're growing that you may already have
but it's also things that you want to
you you want to step back to for example
we've talked I think we've talked
recently in these as I know I've had
these conversations it is the idea of uh
we've talked about it more on a on a
company level rebranding but even within
yourself particularly if you've you know
if you've been doing this for a few
years it's actually rebranding in the
way of s of like your resume or personal
website or your company's website
because there's going to be things that
you did 10 years ago that really don't
make sense right now so if you were a
you could be a very not even Cutting
Edge but like let's say just a Leading
Edge developer 10 gears years ago you
might have been a Leading Edge developer
using flash that you had all these
websites and you were using Adobe Air
and all that kind of stuff doesn't basic
basically doesn't exist anymore no
offense to those you that do it on a
daily basis I know there's a few out
there but not a lot of it out there so
now you maybe have moved on to Let's
sayet or Java or something like that you
need then to upgrade your your your
resume your site and one of the things
we'll talk about is like how do you how
do you handle that stuff because you are
growing you're becoming a better
developer so when do you sort of like
you know cut back the stuff that you
used to have when do you drop dos you
know 3.0 or you know windows or whatever
off of your resume when do you put like
you know basic not Visual Basic but
Capital basic basic off fre list those
kinds of things are what we're going to
sort of get into and a lot of it is
really definitely not a science this is
going to be lessons learned it's where
we have seen some uh some things that
have confused us or that we've done that
have confused others because we have
worked both sides we have we have
interviewed people we have been reviewed
by a lot of people we have been through
text screens we have gone through we've
text screened people I want to just I
think we'll get a lot of that out there
like some of our experience and where
we've seen things that we feel are done
right and where we see some things that
are done wrong and now I say we all the
time and I'm not speaking just in the
Royal wi so I want to have like want you
thr a couple of things like where you
see this going as well Michael because
we've got 30 plus episodes ahead of us
so obviously we're going to cover a lot
of ground yeah yeah as we go through
this journey we're going to be talking
or touching on a lot of the both pain
points of our Journeys some of the
things that we struggled with as well as
a lot of the things that we learned that
oh this is a great idea or how we
excelled in some areas how we struggled
in certain areas and how we basically uh
persevered through some hard times
because in any developer's Journey
you're going to run into situations
where it's like why the hell did I do
this why am I doing this and you kind of
lose that kind
of you you lose that emphasis you lose
that Spirit of hey this is awesome I'm
having fun let's do this especially like
for those of you that are entrepreneurs
and doing
startups you always start out with like
I have this great idea I'm going to do
it and you know you hit the accelerator
you go go go go and then you hit a wall
and then you're like well now what I I
don't want to do this anymore or it
burned out and these are a lot of things
that we have encountered through our
development journey and we're going to
try to talk through some of these topics
and you know help you guys on your
journey of becoming better developers I
mean you could be a junior you could be
a mid-level hell you could be like us
you could be 20 plus years in this
industry and still we're always learning
this journey never ends until you either
retire or basically you decide to throw
your computer out the window and become
a
monk and I think that's it's important
that this is not uh this is a journey
that never end we're we're constantly
having to update and keep going and
honestly I don't know how many times
I've thrown my computer out the window
become a monk and the next thing you
know I'm I'm writing code in the
monastery and then I'm back again and so
you know I think that's something else
that we you that's definitely another
area we want to talk about is
the uh you I I I keep thinking Lion King
Circle of Life but there's a little bit
of like there's seasons of our
development I think that we I know for
me that I have been through where and it
does seem cyclical where it's like you
get into a much like you know software
development life cycle I think in
general it's you'll get into Seasons
where you're doing a lot of coding or
you're doing a lot of maybe you're doing
some project management or some some
team management maybe you're in a lot of
agile then maybe you're in a lot of like
just straight web based applications
maybe you're doing a lot of mobile
there's a it's just those kinds of
things things that I also want to talk
about like what we do when we're in a
certain season to make sure that that
doesn't become a rut because a lot of
this is about us looking at what what do
we accept what do we have to accept
basically as developers because there's
certain things that are just part and
parcel of being a developer your
whatever you know today is going to
disappear doesn't matter how long it is
now there are foundational things and we
I I do want to spend some time on that
because I think that's something that
has served me well is a very strong
foundation in in software development to
start with and by I'm talking about
things like understanding what
Collections and the you know various
patterns are and and some of those like
you know basic concepts of like how do
you do logic like what is The Logical
arithmetic and some of those kinds of
things and even like vectors and data
storage things and stuff that you may or
may not know or you may have come into
it in a uh a very specific way you know
like a Lambda or something like that
that you may have a very different view
of what that looks like from actual you
know like bison and all those and yak
and all those other kinds of things that
are about building languages so there's
a lot out there uh there's a lot that I
want to talk about and I think we're
going to try to do it you know we'll try
to do it like a sort of like a nugget at
a time we'll try to you know take off a
good chewable amount to say here's
something we've done here's some of our
experience and throw some
recommendations out there as well now as
always we do want to get feedback from
you so if you've got some things you
know something that's like maybe
a a big lesson learn in your career that
you would love for us to share you know
or a question like hey I'm stuck I'm
sort of like I've I've hit a ceiling or
uh the one that everybody runs into is
there sort of that fork in the road
where there's some point where you can
go much more you can go into like
management or you go into into
higher-end architecture stuff now some
companies don't even have that sometimes
it's just like you top out and you're
just going to write code write code
write code you just get to write more
code or something like that or write it
faster versus you know hope hopefully
it's a large enough organization that
you're in that allows you to manage or
design and architect Solutions I see you
in the back with your hand up so it's
interesting with that as well we can
also talk about not just those kind kind
of transition but also talk about when
you're in a position or a role and
you're starting to get into a rut or
Things become toxic when do identify
when is it time to either shift gears
and start looking for different
positions or even start looking for
different companies because there are
times where while we're enjoying this
journey we are going to run into
situations where we are not going to be
happy but we as developers a lot of
times though we try to persevere because
we like solving problems you know that's
the whole thing about writing software
but sometimes the problem isn't us the
problem isn't something we can solve and
then it's time to like look at the door
is it time to go somewhere else so these
are some of the things we can address
this season as well I that's a greate
now granted sometimes the problem's not
me it's always Michael but for the rest
of you um I think this is something you
know that is something that we I think
there boy every season of of development
and progression that you're in that is
something that gets handled a little
differently and I think just to sort of
to to wrap this one up is I will I will
flashback a
little looking back at some of the
things that I did starting out and I've
seen this with a lot of other people as
they start out so it's sort of to give
you like a A Slice of Life of some of
the kinds of things we're going to talk
about when I started out I had a I had a
college degree I had a a bachelor's in
computer science so I knew some stuff
about programming and I just come out of
school so I knew some academic stuff
about programming now you may say I
never you know went to school for it I
went to like maybe a boot camp well
you're going to have the same thing
you're going to come out of that boot
camp with the the boot camp shine you're
going to have like this certain thing
that you've now you've done some work
you've built applications probably of
some sort but you've done it in a uh a
lot of times sort of like a pristine
environment you are you are set up in
your projects you are graded on like
you've got to do it right the right way
and the right way is whatever that book
or that Professor or whatever you know
and it's a lot of it is based on the the
goals they want to accomplish what do
they want you to understand coming out
of that
class and when I came out I had like
this is the stuff that I know and I at
that point objector there was no agile
this was like way back you didn't really
have that yet it was close to that time
but but you did have objectoriented and
objectoriented was the thing that was
like objectoriented languages and
inheritance and all this stuff everybody
was just
like in awe at what you could do with
objectoriented because they were they
come out of at this point everybody was
functional Bas so you had all this stuff
you had all this repetitive code you had
all this just crud that you had to sort
through so when I walked into the the
real world and walked out of my academic
environment that was in my head and I
will once again apologize to anybody
that worked with me at the time because
every problem to me because the hammer
that I had was objectoriented and that
was the tool I had so I Ed that on
everything it didn't matter if it was a
a script it didn't matter if it was
batch programming I tried to find a way
to take that big square peg of object
oriented and slam it into a round hole
over and over
again and I'm G to claim you know ask
for forgiveness and all that and and
also claim that it's not my fault
because everybody does that because we
do
we it's it's affected my career ever
since because think we do we get this
thing that's a really shiny new
tool and then we really want to use it
now when we come out of school we have
one tool so we don't really have a lot
of choice or you know we have like a
couple but it's we're really focused but
as you get further into your
career you'll find that you get that
shiny tool again and you're like I
really want to use this it's like if you
go get a new coffee cup you want to have
that you're like I want coffee right now
because I want to use my new cup that
that's something that we struggle with I
think more than we would like to admit
and that's one of those things that
we're going to we will come back to this
at some point in this season and talk
about such things because we do have a
struggle there is a balance of we don't
want to lose it we don't want to have
something that we learned and then not
use it then we lose it but we also don't
want to bore everybody with telling
about how we've got this great new
Silver Bullet solution and then it it
doesn't work and there's there's a lot
of those in the history of what I've
worked through so I'm sure we will this
is not going to be all about failures
and mistakes we did a season on that but
this is going to be about uh a little
bit about lesson learn but really more
about you know more like these are some
things we've done it's our experiences
so hopefully you'll be able to connect
with where you have where you have done
some of the stuff and some of it will be
new there'll be some things like I've
never done something that way so I'm
going to go give that a shot closing
thoughts from
you yeah a lot of this is again this is
the development Journey season so we are
going to be talking about Journeys
through the career of becoming a better
developer and our hope is that by the
end of this season you will have
something to take away even if it's
small
but
something like me that every day you
look at what you're doing and you want
to learn something new you want to
better yourself you want to become
better I think that is well put and a
perfect way to wrap up this first
episode of Season 22 it's just it I'm
still getting my head around this that
we're like that far into this
thing hope you come back and enjoy us on
our journey as we talk about the
developer Journey as always shoot us an
email at info veneur decom if you have
any questions comments suggestions jokes
even if they're dad jokes we'll take
them all may or may not share them
because if they're too puny then it may
just be a little too much for us also
have the YouTube channel we have
developer.com we're out there on X we
are out there on LinkedIn on Facebook
wherever you get your developer nor
material we're we're there uh podcast as
well wherever you consume your podcast
you probably hopefully right now you're
listening to it but subscribe wherever
it is get all the latest stuff we're
cranking this out twice a week and
they'll just make it easier for you to
keep up with us uh you can always ask
the lady in the Box uh also known as
Alexa at some point just hey give me the
latest episode of building better
developers and you know what you'll get
to hear our dlet tones come across the
uh whatever the devices you're listening
on that being said we're going to wrap
this one up we're going to go take a
break come back Season 22 episode 2 will
be next so we will catch you next time
around go out there and have yourself a
great day a great week and we will talk
to you next
time and a wave to those of you that
didn't but yeah it's also a good little
signal to be like cut all right there
goes the uh that's the audio for the
rest of you you get to see the the video
uh I don't know if there's there any
bonus material you want to throw out
there anything that's like sort of a
extra bonus highlight secret uh like you
know secret eggs that we're going to
have somewhere you know out e we have
somewhere in the season it's like keep
an eye out for this one the only extra
thing I would like to add since this is
our introductory episode to the season
is we didn't touch on it but we also
have school ofd developer.com we have
tons of material on the website we have
launching an internet business for those
of you that may not have a website or a
business you know make sure you go out
and check that it's free we W walk you
through the entire setup of setting up
AWS WordPress and basically putting up a
website for free you know check this
stuff out we've got tons of material out
there and if you thought about it
chances are we've either talked about it
or we probably done it or if we haven't
shoot us an email or a text or you know
just communicate to us what you would
like us to talk about and hey we may
throw it on an episode or we might drop
it in the blog yeah sometimes some of
our best topics are you know I haven't
done that I would L like to try it let's
go give it a shot and you next thing you
know we'll have some tutorials or maybe
even a whole season on it depending on
on what it
is we will wrap this one up and we will
come back around soon as you just like I
mentioned every Tuesday and Thursday we
drop these things we have them on you
can get us out on the podcast or you can
join us here on YouTube or if you're
somewhere else like a Chinese YouTube or
wherever you're seeing this you could go
to the original at YouTube or whatever
this pirate channel is that you're
watching uh and actually if you are love
to hear about it just be really
interesting to know that we are
somewhere else especially if we're being
dubbed that would be awesome I would
love to hear somebody dubbing Us in
Swahili or whatever the language happens
to be that being said we'll let you guys
get to it we're going to go back to it
and we will come back with episode two
uh a couple days from now basically when
you next swing around we will be
cranking in to Season 22 have a good one
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